Quote# 113290

I think the analogy to the surgeon and unconscious patient is a good one. It's not battery because it is assumed that the unconscious person would consent to treatment which would help him survive and a reasonable surgeon would operate.

In a marriage, or a relationship, if a party protests that he/she was asleep and didn't give consent, the right approach, IMHO, is for the jury to hear evidence on the prior state of the relationship and whether it was reasonable for the instigator to have assumed that consent was granted prior.

Any other construction leads to absurdities such that we all either know of people (or are guilty ourselves) of rape and are therefore sex offenders who need to do time in prison. It is a normal part of many relationships, and I question the real world implications that a "zero tolerance" policy that some are advocating would have on normal, reasonable people.

Why is it only sex that prior consent is invalid according to this thought? If I tell a neighbor that he is free to come in my house and get a drink from the fridge, does he have to ask me every time to not be guilty of trespass?


ultravires, The Straight Dope 14 Comments [10/3/2015 4:48:39 AM]
Fundie Index: 8

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Kanna

If your neighbor walks in in his underwear for a drink while you're entertaining your boss at a formal dinner, would you rethink that open door policy? Same answer as to the other guy on this topic: A woman, PROPERLY AROUSED, produces vaginal lubricants that make sex a pleasant experience. It can be painful AND UNWELCOME without it. Get it? Protect her, and PROTECT YOURSELF, you ignorant schmucks for whom all talk of sex is purely hypothetical.

10/3/2015 5:01:34 AM

niv

the last sentence bring the opposite conclusion of the post. nobody think that "you should come sometime", means "drop unannounced in the middle of the night and break in".

it almost make me wish it was a poe. no way he can be that stupid.

10/3/2015 5:25:23 AM

FundieVision Inc

No, it isn't. Why? Because if a surgeon is operating and a patient unconscious, they've either consented to that specific surgery, or are in immediate danger of losing their life or have a severe enough injury or condition.

You're opinion is stupid, and moronic. No means no, consent can be given and revoked without explination. You're one of those jackasses who believes in no marital rape apparently.



No dipshit he doesn't, because you gave him a clear and concrete verbal consent to do what he did. However said consent can be revoked at any time, or modified given that it is your home. Just as it is a woman's or man's body. Consent can be given or revoked only by that individual.

10/3/2015 5:41:43 AM



So, if your wife takes advantage of you sleeping to spend 6000 dollars of your account without your consent, no problem?

10/3/2015 6:24:36 AM

nazani14

If I once fed you a spicy burrito, does that mean I can shove one down your throat while you're asleep?

10/3/2015 7:44:44 AM

rubber chicken

Are you trying to argue that your partner would die if you didn't fuck them ?

People are not ferrets.

10/3/2015 8:08:56 AM

Anon-e-moose

The surgeon, anaesthetist, assistants etc are helping in making the patient better. And said patient puts their trust in the medical staff. Thus Consent; more so, in this case.

Which makes this light-years ahead of what your trying to compare it to. Never mind 'Use of Bad Analogy', you never had an argument in the first place for such a comparison to be invalidated.

...oh, and the words 'Malpractice Suit'. Learn them. They could save your life. More-than literally.

10/3/2015 8:16:49 AM

Thinking Allowed

I think the analogy to the surgeon and unconscious patient is a good one. It's not battery because it is assumed that the unconscious person would consent to treatment which would help him survive and a reasonable surgeon would operate.

Before surgery, the patient signs a consent form. In the case of emergency surgery, someone such as spouse, parent, child, or guardian signs the consent form.

10/3/2015 8:49:48 AM

Goomy pls

The patient knows about the surgery beforehand. The recipient should likewise kno about "sleepy sex" beforehand. Not to mention a doctor performing surgery without the patient's consent could get into hot water.

10/3/2015 9:13:28 AM

Old Viking

The people at that site must be very ugly if they all prefer sleeping partners.

10/3/2015 4:58:08 PM

rubber chicken

@Thinking Allowed and Goomy pls

Imagine the following scenario:

You are involved in a road accident, you are knocked unconscious and require a tracheostomy to enable you to breathe.
There is no time to seek consent from your relatives or to wake you up. The operation must be performed immediately or you will die.
Under most jurisdictions, -but by no means all-, the surgeon, doctor or paramedic concerned would be protected under a "Good Samaritan Law" from prosecution.
This is, I believe the kind of situation to which the OP is referring.

10/3/2015 6:53:46 PM

Ebon

Why is it only sex that prior consent is invalid according to this thought? If I tell a neighbor that he is free to come in my house and get a drink from the fridge, does he have to ask me every time to not be guilty of trespass?

Yes, he does. Consent can be revoked at any time before or during the act. That's how the law works.

10/3/2015 7:25:04 PM



So if you've ever allowed a friend to borrow $20 from you, you'd have no problem with them going into your wallet without asking and helping themselves to your money whenever they want?

10/3/2015 9:51:36 PM

JeanP

Except the surgeron wants to save his patient while doing it, while this rapist only search his own sexual gratification.

10/4/2015 12:52:55 PM

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