Quote# 39965

And, the separation of church and state if you actually look at it in depth it's purpose is not to keep religion out of the government or government ordained venues (schools, courthouses, parks, etc.) but meant to keep the government out of religious matters. Besides, ID is not a religious matter. If you look at the proposed theory of Intelligent Design there isn't a religious overtone about it. It doesn't say, "We see scientifically see that Brahama father god of the Hindu religion responsible for the world's inception." There's nothing like that. It merely states that there was something more than chance involved in the origins of the world.

Crazyjust4u, Gaia Forums 56 Comments [5/27/2008 4:35:59 PM]
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Submitted By: Neverspeak

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Thinking Allowed

What part of separation of church and state does Crazyjust4u doesn't understand?

Also the ID theory holds scientific evidence just as well as a paper bag can hold water.

5/27/2008 4:41:28 PM

m52nickerson

ID is not a theory, there is no evidence to support it. ID is a hypothesis at best.

5/27/2008 4:46:26 PM

pete

Then why, I must ask, is every single ID proponent a freakin' fundy?

5/27/2008 4:49:34 PM

Joe-Bob

"It merely states that there was something more than chance involved in the origins of the world."

Thank you for summing up Evolution. Now please, go on about this ID...

5/27/2008 5:00:42 PM

Mister Spak

"And, the separation of church and state if you actually look at it in depth it's purpose is not to keep religion out of the government or government ordained venues (schools, courthouses, parks, etc.) but meant to keep the government out of religious matters."

So you're saying the first amendment is about separation of state and church?


If you look at the proposed theory of Intelligent Design you will see it came into existence immediately after the Supreme Court ruled Scientific Creationism is religion, not science.

5/27/2008 5:02:56 PM

Blayze Kohime

But if it doesn't have anything to do with religion, why did you discredit yourself by starting off by disregarding church/state separation? The argument would have more credit if you left out the first half and then quote reference for the second half.

5/27/2008 5:05:54 PM

The Watcher

"It merely states that there was something more than chance involved in the origins of the world."

Yeah, an "intelligent designer." Nothing religious about that, no sir!

5/27/2008 5:05:57 PM

aaa

It means BOTH.

5/27/2008 5:11:37 PM

McCulloch

OK then, name one supporter and believer in ID who is not a committed evangelical theist.

5/27/2008 5:21:38 PM

Delmania

The issue is that if you don't keep religion out of the government, eventually one will take over and remove the freedoms for the others.

5/27/2008 5:21:53 PM

Doctor Whom

1. Lie

2. Lie

3. Lie.

4. Red herring

5. Lie

6. Straw man

5/27/2008 5:23:11 PM

Grigadil

This Intelligent Designer is a supernatural entity, yes?

Smells like religion to me.

5/27/2008 5:25:03 PM

tmr

Shifting words around and using them randomly does not make what you are saying any more valid.

5/27/2008 5:33:14 PM

Papabear

Since ID invokes the supernatural, it is not science. Creation by supernatural means is only upheld by religions. Therefore, ID has "a religious overtone."

5/27/2008 5:43:16 PM

J

Read the Wedge Document and come back.

5/27/2008 5:50:38 PM

anonymous_troy

If the government-run public schools teach a religious theory [i.e., not backed by reason or science], then they are supporting that religion.

They can't do that, so they only teach secular ... things...

5/27/2008 6:13:44 PM



My 3rd grader came home and told me what was wrong with the pledge having "under god" in it and how it's wrong to make the kids say it after hearing about the seperation of church and state.

My question is how come a 9 year old can get this and yet an adult doesn't? Is it maybe because the adult has an agenda?

And ID is thinly disguised religion.

5/27/2008 6:28:39 PM

Giveitaday

ID is not a valid scientific theory because it cannot produce any data, nor does it make any predictions, It also leads to an infinite regress of who/what designed the designer. Ergo ID cannot be science.

5/27/2008 6:33:46 PM

Shann

Sorry, but goddidit just isn't science. Thank you for playing.

5/27/2008 6:48:25 PM

Quantum Mechanic

"It merely states that there was something more than chance involved in the origins of the world."


And it's religious bullshit.

5/27/2008 6:49:34 PM

Allegory for Jesus

"but meant to keep the government out of religious matters"

What would the government establishing a state church be to you: too much government in your religion, or too much religion in your government? Because, all in all, separation of church and state should not be violated, regardless of its original intent to protect one from the other, because allowing, for instance, state to be subjected to church, the other religious institutions are indirectly being affected by the state by not having an identical influence.

"ID is not a religious matter"

Bzzzzt. Wrong!

"If you look at the proposed theory of Intelligent Design there isn't a religious overtone about it"

Bzzzt. Double wrong! Intelligent Design is not a theory, and the religious overtone exists, (although it is actually an undertone). Intelligent Design is proposing that a nameless entity is responsible for existence, and that nameless entity, in the only conceivable nature that the "theory" could propose without being absurd and pointless (yes, even moreso) would have to be a creative force that is essentially a god. Which is a religious idea, and a proposition whose only support lies within the realm of semantics and bad philosophy, rather than evidence and actual science.

5/27/2008 7:05:23 PM

tracer

Tell me: HOW do you keep the government out of religion, if you don't keep religion out of the government? If the fingers of one are sticking into the other, you are GOING to get cross-contamination, period.

5/27/2008 7:14:31 PM

Princess Rot

"ID is not a religious matter."

I thought I'd never see someone write a sentence so transparently stupid. Of course ID is not religion dressed up in junk science!

5/27/2008 7:15:28 PM

DarkfireTaimatsu


Talking dinosaurs know more than you.

5/27/2008 7:17:14 PM

Old Viking

By not mentioning God ID sure had me fooled for a long time.

5/27/2008 7:21:22 PM

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